Episode 79

By her early 20s, Poppy Jamie was already leading an enviable, “perfect” life: She was a successful TV personality, had her own Snapchat show and designed an accessories line with her best friend Suki Waterhouse. But underneath the gloss of social media was a different reality – an overworked, always-on existence. You know, the kind that paves the road to burnout? She also knew she wasn’t the only one experiencing this kind of stress; DM’s from fans sharing the same struggles confirmed to her there had to be a better way to, in her words, “do life”. In this episode, hear how she addressed her own taxed-out life, learned to relax, let go of perfection and created an app to help others do the same.

 

AnnouncerWelcome to WHERE BRAINS MEET BEAUTY™ hosted by Jodi Katz Founder and Creative Director of Base Beauty Creative Agency™.
Jodi KatzHey there, welcome back to WHERE BRAINS MEET BEAUTY™. This week’s episode features Poppy Jamie. She's the founder of Happy Not Perfect. And, there's no coincidence that this episode is launching on International Mental Health Day. So, I hope you enjoy this episode and get a lot out of Poppy's life philosophies. And, if you missed last week's episode, it featured Divya Gugnani, she's the founder of Wander Beauty. Hope you enjoy the shows.
Jodi KatzHey everybody, welcome back to the show. I am so happy to be sitting next to Poppy Jamie. She's the founder of Happy Not Perfect. Welcome to WHERE BRAINS MEET BEAUTY™.
Poppy JamieOh, thank you so much for having me. I'm a massive fan of the podcast.
Jodi KatzOh, you're so sweet. Let's start with something easy to talk about 'cause everybody always wants to know this. How are you spending your day today?
Poppy JamieOh my gosh. Okay, today I had a really wild day. I actually was just on Charter TV which is the New York Stock Exchange. So, it was a real experience. I walked in there and there were just men in suits for miles and it was a television show where we were talking about mental health. But, it just so happened as happens that it's hosted in the New York Stock Exchange.
Jodi KatzAnd, are you doing press for most of the day today?
Poppy JamiePress and then, [inaudible 00:01:25] is quite close by so he dropped in for a marketing meeting and a strategy on the release of our future product. And then, I had another voice, I had a video call meeting, oh no, I've had two video call meetings. So, my day.... Oh, no three. So, my day started at 8:00 a.m. from either video calls, Skype meetings, real meetings, press meetings, yeah so it's a whole host of things.
Jodi KatzAnd, is that a normal day?
Poppy JamieYeah, it really is because in a start up you have to wear so many hats. No one has a job title really it's just get stuff done and I think being founder you've just got to sit on so many different facets of the business whether it's, I'm highly involved in actually creating the app. But, also how we're talking about the app and everything else that goes along with a small company that you're trying to run a hundred miles an hour and you have minimal people.
Jodi KatzAnd, what is Happy Not Perfect?
Poppy JamieSo, Happy Not Perfect is a my influence app with a difference. I created it because I was struggling to meditate. I was feeling super stressed out and I was a television host at the time. I had a TV show on Snapchat. And, what I realized is that everybody was stressed out. I received all of these messages saying, "I just feel anxious about home, work, the future. I'm tired. I'm frazzled." I was reading them saying, "Yeah me too, me too, me too, and it was this moment of surely like we can't just all struggle". Life wasn't there for us all to struggle through. Surely there is a different way that we can do life and this kind of psychological study turned into an entire research intensive, seven day a week kind of research project into what we could all do to help ourselves feel more relaxed, know ourselves better, sleep better, and be able to manage our minds so we feel less anxious.
Jodi KatzSo, I've said this to you twice, because it's really amazing to me. You're so young to have already evolved into a human that has this awareness. I mean, I'm 43 so I'm on this journey and this journey sort of started not that long ago. So, I'm so grateful that you are so young and doing this for yourself, to be able to enjoy each day more.
Poppy JamieThat's so kind.
Jodi KatzIt's very hopeful to me that even my kids could get there early, right? That we can all get there earlier.
Poppy JamieA 100% and I look around and I feel there is a mass wake up call of us suddenly going, "Hold on a minute, what does it mean to be a human being? I don't want to feel this stressed out. I don't want my kids to feel this stressed out. How do we learn to think better?" And, if you look at technology, we're getting upgrades for our phones every six months, IOS12, IOS13, but why are we not upgrading our minds and the way we're thinking? And, when you really look into the science you realize that we think like cavemen did, but actually there aren't any lions. So, we have this negative bias because let's say hundreds of years ago it was really useful for us to look for the negative first. You'd walk into an environment and you'd go, "Okay where's the lion? Oh, I see one over there let's get out, get out everyone we're in danger." Whereas now we have this kind of, we're wanting to see the negative in the situations which actually doesn't help us at all. So, we're willing to practice rewiring our brain to look to the positive first.
Jodi KatzIt's so interesting that you say that. I didn't this, but it makes a lot of sense because I was always negative first. I mean I suffered from self doubt in so many things that I'm unraveling now, but yeah I want to walk into situations with a positive attitude and a grateful attitude, but historically it was the opposite for me.
Poppy JamieTotally and also most, I would say 99.9% of people it's like that. So, it's kind of as a group we're like, "Okay, time to be human beings in 2018". So, that was very normal for us to be negative first.
Jodi KatzRight, okay. So, I have a really important question for you and this episode might turn into a little bit of a therapy session so our listeners should know this might get heavy. But, I'm a recovering perfectionist and I'm really curious about how do you define the word perfect.
Poppy JamieThis is such a good question. I think perfect is such a confusing word because often it has been created by other people's expectations. So, what we believe perfect is in the eyes of our parents or what the world thinks is perfect. How we should look is created by brands that create an idea of perfection. And so, it means that most of us are running to other people's versions of perfect which is often unattainable and we're running to this rainbow where there's this pot of gold and we just suddenly get there and we're like, "Oh no I've got to run another distance, and another distance, and another distance." And, we get more tired and more self hating because we're not reaching other people's idea of perfection.
Jodi KatzYes, I was always chasing perfection and I told you that since I had this awakening I realized that the word perfect shouldn't even be a word because it doesn't exist.
Poppy JamieRight, it doesn't exist.
Jodi KatzThere's nothing in the world that's perfect.
Poppy JamieOh my gosh, you're so right.
Jodi KatzAnd, once I realized that I was able to calm down.
Poppy JamieYeah, like majorly chill out.
Jodi KatzYes.
Poppy JamieYeah.
Jodi KatzI was so fixated on other people's point of views and trying to read everyone else's minds and I think that's a root of the perfectionism.
Poppy JamieAbsolutely. I find that when we lead lives wanting to be perfect it is like walking around life with a really heavy back pack. It is so heavy trying to always be kind of better and nothing is, essentially you don't think you're good enough, that's really what comes from being a perfectionist and I'm also a recovering perfectionist. Perfectionist anonymous, that should be a group. And, it's exhausting living life, and to be honest it takes awhile to realize that you're doing it.
Jodi KatzRight. So, do you remember your first moments of perfectionism?
Poppy JamieYes, well I think the moment I realized that really one of the main reasons for calling Happy Not Perfect, Happy Not Perfect was I woke up in the middle of the night just thinking to myself, imagine if you made decisions based on what made you happy rather than what you thought made you perfect? So, deciding actually I don't want to go to the party, and this feeling of oh but I should, but if I don't do that then. Or, no I don't want to do that career, but maybe I should. Or, no actually I want to eat this. And, this idea of just actually living life for me rather than others. And, that was this moment of these words Happy Not Perfect and it was like this huge weight came off me. And I thought, oh my God life now just seems so much brighter because I just made that conscious decision that I'm going to start making decisions for me.
Jodi KatzThat's so interesting you talk about that because it echos the sentiment of another one of our guests several years ago. Her name's [inaudible 00:08:55] and she's in her 50's and it's just recently that she discovered that she's living her whole life for other people, right? So, this is a really important theme I think happening with women today at least like ambitious women that I know.
Poppy JamieYeah, and also if I speak to a lot of college students and this huge focus on success. And, if you look at, and I think technologies got a bit part to play in it because take ourselves back 40 years ago, we didn't know what our brother's girlfriend's mother's babysitter's dog owner's wife was doing, but now we do. And, actually we don't need to know 80% of the information, 90% of the information that is bombarded at us, and because we spend so long on social media this comparison is a thief of all joy. You've had a great holiday and then suddenly you look online and oh God you didn't have sunshine everyday you had rain one day, but your friend had sunshine everyday and you're holiday was a little bit worse than you imagined it to be. And, it is, it's like other people's feeds are stealing away our happiness. And also, this idea that suddenly we've walked into this world of perfectionism, filtered photographs, and not even knowing what's real or not. So, I think it's become more of an issue than ever because of the fact that we're living so much of our lives through social media accounts.
Jodi KatzSo, let's talk about social because obviously it's the best bull horn we have right now for telling our own stories, right? So, social's an important facet of Happy Not Perfect, and it's an important facet of my podcast and other things I do. But, I don't want to be that person who's like always on and I don't want to feed into the devil on my shoulder, right? So, how do we reconcile that we can actually reach a community of like minded people here? But, in order to do that I'm still going to see things that are complicating that for me.
Poppy JamieYeah, and I think that's when you've got to become so strict about who you follow, about what information you're consuming. So, I will often go through who I'm following and say, "Okay are all of these accounts making me feel good? What of these accounts, what content are they creating?" Because for example the Happy Not Perfect account, we only follow positive accounts and written loads of positive quotes. And so, the Happy Not Perfect account is very much about positive quotes and uplifting kind of tips of the day. And it's amazing to me how uplifting an experience on social media is because I'm only seeing inspiration whereas on my own personal account having spent years, oh maybe I'll follow this person, maybe I'll follow this person, you can then be confronted by stuff that doesn't make you feel great.
Jodi KatzRight, so it's actually asking me sort of to curate the way that I would curate my friends right after I evolve as a human, I would be curating my feeds that I follow.
Poppy JamieYes, totally and if there's ... And, look I'm really unconfrontational so I would never want to unfollow a friend and make them feel bad so I just mute their account. So, they don't know I'm not unfollowing them, I just don't need to be triggered by their content.
Jodi KatzThat's such good advice because I go down the rabbit hole and I'm not even like really on social that much compared to other people, but I can feel myself going down the rabbit hole. Sometimes it's food videos and hair dye videos which I think are totally fine, but then yeah it leads me into the dark worlds of crazy fitness people and it gets kind of dark and scary down there. But, I love this idea, I can do this, I can curate for myself.
Poppy JamieYeah.
Jodi KatzYeah, that's curating for my well being.
Poppy JamieA 100% percent, and I think technology can get a really bad rap. And so, I think it's using it in moderation, everything in moderation is good, you know? And so, I would say it's not really bad we can just manage it better.
Jodi KatzRight, but then if I've curated the experience then I'm going to see positive messages from positive like minded feeds, I'm going to feel good about the experience.
Poppy JamieYeah totally.
Jodi KatzOkay, got it. Thank you for that tip. Okay. So, you mentioned you were a TV host before this, what was your day to day like back then?
Poppy JamieOh my gosh. As a TV host it was crazy because especially when I was at London, I would have to interview maybe five different people a day so it was just always on the go. And then, I'd edit my own content and so it was honestly 6:00 a.m. till midnight maybe, super intensive, and I think that's really what led me to being really burned out. I suffered from adrenal burn out which is just unbelievably high stress levels for a long period of time and my body was just like, snapped, you're not doing it anymore. And, I was really sick and energy level was so low, always tired. I was kind of wondering if it was glandular fever. I was wondering if it was all of these different things and the doctors said, "You've got adrenal burn out, you're energy levels. You need to rest." And, I think this is, and since I had it I've heard from so many especially women suffering from just kind of long term exhaustion because we're pushing ourselves so hard. And, this idea of we've got to have great jobs, and we've got to look great, and we've got to date. Just from all angles we're pushing ourselves to the very last kind of juice of energy we have and we're not prioritizing rest or sleep. So, my TV host schedule really was the catalyst for going, "Stop and reevaluate your life and start prioritizing different things".
Jodi KatzIt's so interesting that you mentioned that you were an on air talent, you were a producer, and you were an editor of your own work, which I can imagine was incredible resources for what you're doing right now though.
Poppy JamieTotally a 100%, I totally, yeah it's so. I look back at that period and I'm grateful for essentially being forced to learn everything you could possibly learn to put together a TV show. And, I don't remember having a weekend off. I literally worked every single day. Yeah. So, it yes taught me a lot, but also taught me probably the most valuable lesson is how to relax.
Jodi KatzRight. So, were you chasing after this ideal that was expected of you back then? Is that why you were working seven days a week?
Poppy JamieYeah, I actually think it probably came from a really insecure place. I felt that I was worthless until I had made myself a success. And, when I realized that, you suddenly go oh okay, I love ambition and I really enjoy working hard, but knowing why you're working really hard I think is something that's important to reflect on because that's unhealthy.
Jodi KatzRight. So, what was the definition of success for you back then?
Poppy JamieI think I ... Being honest I probably was, I mean I think I had such outward confidence. I'd walk into a room and be like, "Hi, hi", but inward I thought I was so useless that any, this where it comes from perfection. I thought I was successful when inside I felt confident. And so, as a consequence you, outside work does not equate to inner work, we have two sets of work to do. And, you know, what Instagram feed of interviewing this celebrity or that celebrity, I wasn't feeling any better inside. So, that was a big moment.
Jodi KatzIt's making me think about, I'm actually going way back to when I was 6, 7, 8, 9, 10 years old to at night before I went to bed almost every night I would rearrange a little like [inaudible 00:17:09] on my shelf, like the little Tinker Bell thing and the little dolls and toys. I would rearrange them because I think I was looking to do something with this perfectionism energy like making different, not playing with them. Like I played of course during the day, but my ritual before bed was to straighten them up and reorganize them, and line them up maybe little to big or big to little, or make them in little collections. And ...
Poppy JamieWhy do you think you did that?
Jodi KatzI think I needed to expend that energy. I needed to feel some sort of control. And, they didn't talk back, you know? They weren't emotionally complicated and it was my zone, right? It was my room when I was alone. So, I think that was my real self coming out because like you I moved through the world, people thinking I was very comfortable in it but I wasn't.
Poppy JamieYeah, it's so interesting. I do think this is something that is, many women can relate to, putting on this front and also like, but what's behind the curtain? 'Cause really Happy Not Perfect has been such a healing experience for myself as well as other people.
Jodi KatzYeah, I'm having so many memories happy right now. This is kind of big and I'll probably visit is a little bit later, but okay let's talk a little bit about this idea of people pleasing. You called it the disease to please which I feel like you should trademark or something.
Poppy JamieIt's Oprah's. It is Oprah's. Yeah, Oprah said this. She is like, "Honey, do you have the disease to please?" And, I was like, "I do. I do." It's so brilliant, the disease to please. Oh my gosh. And, I think a lot of how you were brought up, you were told to be good. So, you want that affirmation, you want that validation, but as a consequence it kind of goes back to our first conversation. You spend all your energy trying to please everyone around you and then suddenly you don't have very much left for yourself.
Jodi KatzSo, how does the disease to please, how did it play out for you?
Poppy JamieSo, the disease to please really probably what's led to my kind of exhaustion and burn out because someone would say, "Oh would you mind just writing this up for me?" "Yeah, no problem. I'll write that up for you." "Oh, would you mind just doing this?" "Oh,yeah." And, my friend be like, "Well can you organize my birthday party as well?" "Yeah, yeah of course I can. I've got to be a good friend." "But, oh my God you will make sure that you know you organize your mother's flowers." "Yeah, yeah, no problem." And so, constantly you're saying yes, yes, yes, yes, because you want to be pleasing everyone in your life and really I was the one just, my health was like you can't do this for very much longer.
Jodi KatzSo, this is, the things that we're talking about, the people pleasing, the perfectionism, these are not easy things to turn off. You can't just flick a switch.
Poppy JamieNo, because they're habits. And, what's so interesting about our brain is science has proven that it is made of plastic, so neuroplasticity. And, when I came across this term it was like night and day, I was like you're kidding me. And so, the scientist that I worked with very closely at UCLA to build Happy Not Perfect. He said, "Yeah didn't you know that? That you can remold your brain?" I was like, "No, tell me more". And, this whole idea of habits and the way that we were maybe brought up, so nature, nurture, all of those things. So, we all have the power to change them and change the way our thinking happens. So, we don't need to always have the disease to please. You can retrain you brain to think differently. You can retrain your brain for example, the negative and the positive. We all have the capability to retrain our brain to look for the positive over the negative. So, that's really my focus point on the seed of what Happy Not Perfect was because I thought there are so many things that I need to work on, but how do I do it and it is possible? And, I found out it is possible and then I wanted to create a tool to answer how, how do you do it.
Jodi KatzWhat is the term for what's the brain made out of?
Poppy JamieNeuroplasticity
Jodi KatzAnd, it's not obviously really plastic, but is that just about the moldability?
Poppy JamieYes.
Jodi KatzHow we can reshape it?
Poppy JamieTotally.
Jodi KatzSo, it's like silly putty in there?
Poppy JamieLiterally our brains like silly putty. It's so fascinating and I thought how are we not told this when we're nine years old.
Jodi KatzYeah, why aren't we?
Poppy JamieWell, they are just bringing on mental health education to schools in New York actually. It only got announced two days ago, but this is what we've been campaigning for as well. This idea of we should all be knowing these facts about our brain. We all know that we need to brush our teeth, that's a given. And, we all know that if we wanted to become more flexible you would stretch, like that's normal. And, the same normality needs to be applied to the mind and the brain that if you want to change it you can, it just is repetition and exercise.
Jodi KatzRight, as a mom of two kids, age 11 and 7 I can understand how valuable this would be as a lesson. 'Cause we talk about it at home, but if it was reinforced in other places as well. Like, you're having a bad day, this will pass, tomorrow will be different, and that's just part of the human experience, right?
Poppy JamieTotally.
Jodi KatzWhich helps me unravel the perfectionism, right? Not everyday is amazing and jump for joy, sometimes they really suck. But, we're here and we're alive, and that's what's important.
Poppy JamieSo true.
Jodi KatzBut yeah, I never really thought about if there was in phys ed a physical elements or component, right? These kids would be learning that oh okay this really stunk I did bad on a test, or I was ignored at lunch, but I can move on from this.
Poppy JamieAbsolutely, and I have the power to.
Jodi KatzRight.
Poppy JamieAnd also, I was angry, that's a normal emotion, but I can change, I don't need to be in an angry mood still.
Jodi KatzYes, having the ability to restartd the day is something I learned recently. I hope my kids learn it earlier than me.
Poppy JamieYes. And so, one of the biggest kind of skills I think I learned through this journey was ... It sounds so stupid and simple, but breathing, this idea of taking a belly breath because 9 out of 10 people only breathe through their chests. So, you ask them to breathe and they inhale, their shoulders rise, and they exhale and their shoulders drop. Whereas our neck and shoulder muscles are nothing to do with breathing, there's no reason why we should be moving our neck and shoulder muscles up.
Jodi KatzOkay. So, can we do a breathe ...
Poppy JamieYeah. So, do a breathe now, do a big inhale and exhale. Yeah. So, you're a bad breather.
Jodi KatzOh, that's so sad. Okay, how can I become a better breather?
Poppy JamieBut don't worry, 9 out of 10 people are bad breathers so if you put your hands on your belly. Okay, and I want you to relax your shoulders down and keep them down. And, on you inhale, I want you to inhale your belly as if you're pregnant.
Jodi KatzSo, you want me to expand my belly?
Poppy JamieYeah, expand your belly and inhale.
Jodi KatzWhile I'm inhaling?
Poppy JamieYeah, and inhale, expand your belly as if you're pregnant, and exhale. And, move your belly to your spine, squeeze all the air out. Now, inhale, expand your belly, sip some more air in, and exhale.
Jodi KatzThat's harder.
Poppy JamieYeah it is. It's using all your belly muscles.
Jodi KatzIs that how you breathe while you're moving through the day or just when you're looking for these deep [inaudible 00:24:36]
Poppy JamieWell, I mean up unto the age of five years old, you belly breathe. And then, at the age of five years old you move into a chest breather because we usually get sent away to school and we start breathing hunched over desks. So, when you want to feel relaxed in any moment thing about the belly breathe. It's very difficult because we have been, for how ever many years, 20 years, 30 years, 40 years, 50 years been breathing badly. So, we need to consciously just spend one minute. And, on the app it till teach you how to belly breathe. This idea of you can sit at your desk, and this is so brilliant about it because the people that meditate they're like I need to do something, I need to calm myself down. And, this idea that you can start the day at any point, the belly breathe is the best tool for that. So, you can sit there, hands on your belly and just breathe in, expand your belly, feel your whole belly expand, just expand it as if you're pregnant and exhale.
Jodi KatzRight, so my body wants to do the opposite, when you were asking me to ...
Poppy JamieYeah, it wants to breathe vertically and you want to go horizontal.
Jodi KatzRight, my body as I'm breathing in wants to suck my belly in and when I breathe out wants to push it out, but that' the opposite of what you're asking me to do.
Poppy JamieAbsolutely opposite.
Jodi KatzOkay.
Poppy JamieYes absolutely, because if you think about it you want as much oxygen, when you're breathing in you want as much oxygen in there as possible. And, you want to exhale and you want to squeeze all that old stale oxygen and carbon dioxide that you don't need out. So, you want to squeeze it, squeeze it, squeeze it, and make your body as small as possible. And, on your inhale you want to expand the lungs, really feel all the lungs out, feel the expansion, yeah, and exhale.
Jodi KatzIt's way harder.
Poppy JamieSqueeze, squeeze, squeeze, and one belly breathe is the equivalent of six chest breaths.
Jodi KatzOkay.
Poppy JamieAnd, you may feel a bit light headed.
Jodi KatzYeah.
Poppy JamieBecause you aren't used to that amount of oxygen, but it's so brilliant your oxygenizing your entire body, and your brain most importantly, to relax your mind.
Jodi KatzOkay, I can do this. I'm so grateful. That's so awesome. I'm going to be starting to talk about that. So, last topic I want to talk about is, it's sort of I guess a summary and the whole point of what you're doing here. So, I'm someone who suffers from self doubt, insecurity, people pleasing, probably a lot of other things as well. Can you really turn your life around?
Poppy JamieOh my gosh, a 100%. And, I say that from being that person. I suffered from all of those things and Happy Not Perfect was really the education that I found from scientists, neuro scientists, CBD specialists, world experts like the breathing expert Doctor [inaudible 00:27:20] and put them all in one app. And, really it's like a mind gym, so anything is possible to be turned around if you want to commit to it. And, that's just like your physical health. You wouldn't run a marathon without training and the same goes for our mind. If you want to feel more relaxed, if you want to sleep better, if you want to be able to have control of your emotions, it is all bound to practice.

So, for example in the app we have, it asks you everyday to write grateful diary. So simple, so great to do with kids. And so, what can we be grateful for today? And immediately they're like, "Mom and dad, and the sunshine. We have two legs and we've got breakfast." And, it's such a fun experience of teaching them to look around with a glass half full. And, one thing we have on the app too is burn bitten where this idea that when you have worries or you're anxious you get to write down, you get to type it all out and then you're able to set fire to the whole screen.
Jodi KatzThat's so fun.
Poppy JamieYeah, this idea of just like release.
Jodi KatzI actually do that in my head, but I love the idea of being able to see it visually.
Poppy JamieYes, totally. Just let it go.
Jodi KatzThat's so fun.
Poppy JamieBecause you know, everything that we go through, every memory, every experience we remember. Our brain is like Velcro to negative experiences, but yet when we're told a compliment we forget it within a second. And so, this idea that we need to again retrain and practice that our brain is going to let go of those negative experiences and actually focus on those positive ones, because actually there's a lot more positive ones than negative we just have a hard time remembering it. And then, there's exercises in the app like self compassion. And, when is the last time you sat down and wrote yourself a compliment? And, again these exercises that seem so stupid, but it's like if you take the sit up as an example. If I said, "Oh my God I just invented this amazing thing that's going to transform your body. It just requires you to basically sit up and down." You'd be like, "What? That is so simple". And, that's the thing is that your mind is just the same. There's really simple exercises that help you be able to use it in a way that's going to help you be your best self and that is that kind of how I like to call it the emotional resilience muscle, that bounce back mechanism. Because no matter who we are we're going to go through set backs. We're going to have challenges. They always say if everybody threw their problems up in the air we'd all want to capture our own. We have no idea what other people are going through even if they have a really shiny profile of pretty pictures. But, we all have a responsibility for our own bounce back kind of skill set. And so, that's kind of, I couldn't recommend anyone more practicing and developing their bounce back skills.
Jodi KatzOkay, I love that everybody can do this. This is amazing.
Poppy JamieYes.
Jodi KatzOkay. So, my last question for you is what is your long term vision for Happy Not Perfect? What are you hoping to achieve or where do you want it to go?
Poppy JamieWell, I really say we're an education first mission brand. So, we're developing these mental well being products like little sleep better sprays and supplements that will be able to help you balance your guy bacteria to affect your mood and stuff. But so, they're all fun and I can't wait for them to launch, but really I really hope Happy Not Perfect can be an education first brand where we really help educate people about their mind and so they know how to use it to the best of their ability. And so, really I hope it's just kind of a really positive force in people's lives, in whatever aspect whether you download the app, or you follow Instagram, or you buy the products, I don't mind, but I just want it to be something in your life that is looking after you because it's easy to forget about ourselves when we're that busy.
Jodi KatzI love it. Well, thank you for sharing your wisdom with us today.
Poppy JamieOh, that's so kind. Thanks for having me on.
Jodi KatzAnd, for our listeners I hope you enjoyed this interview with Poppy. Please subscribe to our series on iTunes and for updates about the show follow us on Instagram at WHERE BRAINS MEET BEAUTY™ podcast.
AnnouncerThanks for listening to WHERE BRAINS MEET BEAUTY™ with Jodi Katz. Tune in again for more authentic conversations with beauty leaders.
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